The Invisible Skyscrapers Podcast

Episode 11. Catch up w/ cadet Rikki

• Rikki Mount • Season 1 • Episode 11

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H6 hired Rikki as a cadet from 42 Adelaide – an exciting enterprise (with a lot of Macs) that provides free coding tuition. Brad and Erika learned more about Rikki during the in-person  H6 conference held in Alice Springs in August.

Brad:

H6's Invisible Skyscrapers, episode 11? I thought we're up to about 500 by now and I'm here with tricky Rikki and Rikki is a brand new person to H6 and we're gonna talk a bit about what Rikki's done and where she's come from and a few other bits and pieces. So 42, tell us all about it.

Rikki:

yeah, sure. So 42 Adelaide is the first campus in Australia that's part of the 42 group, which has got a bit of a long history. But basically it was founded by someone who wasn't very satisfied with the boundaries that people were facing with education, having to pay for stuff. So it's just like this hundred percent free coding school and it's in Adelaide as the flagship, and it is really cool. It's just such a cool people.

Brad:

cool.

Rikki:

Such cool concept. Yeah. It's

Brad:

42. It's a great place to go.

Rikki:

Yeah it's amazing. I remember when I went on the tour there the first time there's this giant room full of macs, never seen so many Macs, so shiny, and there's like a PlayStation and VR room and like a Lego room. And it's just, it's a, it's a nerdy...

Brad:

I think Louise told me there was 210 macs or something.

Rikki:

There's a lot in there. Yeah.

Brad:

A lot of Is, iMacs Yeah.

Rikki:

Yeah.

Erika:

And what did you do before 42?

Rikki:

So I finished studying a deployment of software development in the last two years. I've just moved to Adelaide to do that and then heard about 42 and thought that sounds amazing. I have to get in on that action, which is, it's completely paid for by sponsorship, which is like H6 is a sponsor of 42 it's

Brad:

We were one of the first ones.

Rikki:

Yeah and businesses like that, is what lets people have a free education. It's amazing.

Erika:

And before 42, you were in newspapers and Brad's

Brad:

a printer

Erika:

printer,

Brad:

printer not a newspaper printer. I was, I was a different type of printer, but yeah,

Rikki:

yeah, our newspaper print is rough.

Brad:

Yeah.

Rikki:

Yeah. I was a graphic designer at a country newspaper for about seven years, service seven years for fridges smashing her.

Brad:

and yeah.

Rikki:

This week's specials, contouring a lot of fruit and veg.

Brad:

Yep. Yep. And contouring, if you're listening to this, you don't know quite what that means, it means cutting out your pictures make things look better in black and white,

Rikki:

but it it's an art form. of its own. Yeah. You

Brad:

Did you have to make negatives?

Rikki:

No, well, I think that was done out the back. By the printers. I think it was when I first started there, they were still doing that. They had only just moved to a machine that was printing onto the plates directly.

Brad:

direct to plate. Yeah. So you probably dunno what a Bromite is or do you?

Rikki:

Is that the negative?

Brad:

No, it's like you take, you take a normal photo, you put a screen over the top of the photo and you take, so it's got the dots. yeah So you can't, otherwise you don't, you can't print it. So that's probably what the printers did

Rikki:

maybe.

Brad:

It's what I used to

Rikki:

I'm not sure.

Brad:

Very cool.

Rikki:

Yeah it was.

Erika:

And Rikki, you are quite similar to Brad when Brad mentions he's got H6, people go how did you get to software from retail and print? Do you often get people going why are you in software when you were this graphic design...

Rikki:

yeah, for sure. Actually, that was mentioned quite a lot when I went to TAFE, excuse me. It's apparently fairly unusual, to, to structure those skill sets, like to come from a more creative background and to go into coding is not that common. And it can be beneficial really to understand both sides of the coin, so to speak.

Brad:

I think it's very beneficial

Rikki:

for sure.

Brad:

I just think you see it more from a customer's point of view and one of the issues I see with engineering is that you are very clinical about your and you are building something and you are thinking about all the structure of that thing. You're not thinking about who's gonna use it. You might be. I also think as a creative person, you're are more used to criticism because doing creative stuff is so subjective. as an engineer, it's you are, you are right. Simple as that ones and zeros. You're right.

Rikki:

It's much more absolute. Yeah.

Brad:

And it works or it doesn't. And so I think coming from that background of deadlines, people's opinions, making people happy. I think that is extraordinary because most engineers would crumple with some of the criticism that gets leveled at people in the industry.

Rikki:

Yeah. That's so true.

Erika:

Do you feel like your communication skills have made a difference to your coding journey?

Rikki:

Picked up in the industry? I've always been just a massive reader, so I've always had decent communication skills not that I'm displaying them terribly well right now. I think that, I mean, in software, if you look at software and communication in software and it, for example, scoping, It just shows how important it is that you communicate everything with a client during the scoping phase. Because if you,

Brad:

you could do what we used to do, not scope, just start the project.

Rikki:

How did that go for you?

Brad:

Sometimes pretty good. Sometimes Sometimes pretty bad.

Rikki:

So not good. Exactly. And that's exactly. Yeah. Yeah. Perfect example. If you're saying something you don't know what someone's hearing is, is what you meant for them to hear.

Brad:

Yeah.

Rikki:

Right.

Brad:

or you could be like the guy off Seinfeld, no soup for you. Yeah. No code for you.

Rikki:

Yeah.

Brad:

and we did have engineers that were like that.

Rikki:

Yeah.

Brad:

Yeah.

Erika:

It's important to have that communication skills at a start in that scoping process with the clients?

Rikki:

Sure.

Erika:

But how do you feel that impacts you?. What's the impact of communication internally within a dev pod or once things have started going?

Rikki:

I mean, I feel like communication is essentially the same in any area that you're talking about like anyone who's been in a relationship knows how important communication skills are. they well that might be why they're not in a relationship.

Brad:

Just blanket there.

Rikki:

Yeah. Well, have some

Brad:

experience

Rikki:

experience of how important communication skills are? Well, they've met another human being. Yeah. If they've ever had a social interaction.

Brad:

If they're a man possibly not.

Rikki:

Oh no. Look, Brad said that. I think there's, big levels of communication and the little levels of communication and you've gotta make sure that everyone's got everything straight to avoid problems

Brad:

or you could do what I do is say let's all jump off that bridge together and see what

Rikki:

That does sound fun

Brad:

No, well, actually most of the time I don't do it so much anymore, but I used to get very excited when we only was only three of us in the, in the company. And I would get very excited and say, goodie, goodie, we're doing this. And Ryan and Johan would just go white

Rikki:

Oh no.

Brad:

and Johan would almost. Ryan would smile and say, well, that sounds adorable, and anyone that knows Ryan will know what adorable means. Yeah. And then we'd go on from there.

Rikki:

Oh dear

Brad:

I know it was a bit of an oh dear moment, but we're okay now.

Rikki:

Yeah.

Erika:

So how do you effectively communicate then, Rikki?

Rikki:

Oh,

Erika:

and Brad,

Brad:

how is her

Erika:

answer going to differ from yours?

Rikki:

Yeah, I think I just, I personally am always looking to make sure that the person I'm communicating with is getting what I'm saying, not, never assume that it's all on the same level and I mean, tech isn't necessarily known for being filled with people with excellent communication skills and it's often a shyness thing and maybe just. I don't know, like I'm a gamer myself. I'm not someone who really goes out and socialises heaps. I I'm a stay at home and play online games person, but I just,

Brad:

Whereas I'd rather stick pins in my eyes.

Rikki:

Oh,

Brad:

I know. It's I just, my attention span just isn't there.

Rikki:

dude. Yeah, I don't really, I haven't really evaluated it in that sense. I just go with what feels right. That's a terrible answer. I'm so sorry.

Erika:

Brad, how do you

Brad:

What was the question again?

Erika:

how do you, how do you ensure you communicate effectively? So listening would be a good step.

Brad:

Well, yeah, listening, listening being interested if I'm interested, I'm really I'm I'm there at the moment. I'm your person. I'm completely engaged Having a purpose. I find that going into a conversation and having a purpose to the conversation helps with communication going into conversation and talking around circles, I find difficult because it's just getting through to that communication and making a decision, let's just move on. in of just communication on a personal level. I don't know. I suppose I try to find out something about those people So there's, a common connection. Something we can talk about, because the things that I'm into are not like what you were just saying, Rikki about gaming

Rikki:

Yeah

Brad:

are not what I'm in, not what I'm into, but I know people who are gamers. So I can relate, and I can see why you would like to do that. You would probably look at me and go, why would you wanna ride down a five metre start hill at 60 Ks? Now I don't see the benefit

Rikki:

That's accurate.

Brad:

Yeah. So I have, there's plenty of people in my life that are very different to me. But what I like about communication is finding out those differences.

Rikki:

Mm-hmm.

Brad:

I don't like mixing with the same person all the time, if that makes

Rikki:

Yeah.

Erika:

And how do you do that at work? Communicate?

Brad:

Do I? I suppose again, going back to those common interests, going back to within a, using the strengths, I might have within a conversation or a meeting, not making an assumption with the other person that they might be at the same place that I am. And also recognising fear. I think that's important when you're having an overall conversation with somebody, whether it's in a meeting or negotiating with a client, it's thinking about what their fears might be.

Rikki:

Yeah.

Brad:

Because everybody has them and it might be loss of face. It might be they want to be stay pretty private. So there's certain, like within H6 there's certain conversations I have with some people and there's conversations I have with other people because I understand privacy might be a thing, whereas me, you ask me a question I'll tell you anything you wanna know,

Rikki:

Mm-hmm

Brad:

and trying to see where those boundaries are. Because for me personally, I really don't have any boundaries, not really, but a lot of other people do.

Rikki:

true,

Brad:

and I appreciate that. I don't want to step on those lines and know, make people feel uncomfortable. That's probably the main thing I would say. I don't wanna make people feel uncomfortable in any conversation I have.

Erika:

Rikki, do you share any similarities with the way Brad communicates?

Rikki:

I think just treating people like humans and, and not just looking at them as a client or as the person who's there for the function and then, and having an interest in people as people is, it might be what I meant by naturally.

Brad:

And I, I, what I would say too is it's been really cool to see you guys in the flesh,

Rikki:

Yeah.

Brad:

When Erika and I travel to Adelaide, we've got this really hectic program that we do and we see you for a little bit To actually see you guys in the office and see how you interact with other people?

Rikki:

yeah.

Brad:

See how you are communicating with other people. Gives me some insights into how I can further communicate with you. person I think

Rikki:

just learning about people.

Brad:

Yeah.

Erika:

and Rikki, do you consider yourself a superwoman?

Rikki:

Am I superwoman? No,

Brad:

well, she's certainly very tricky. I'm not,

Rikki:

I'm not superwoman. If I had to have a superpower look, I can't say that I've applied a superpower to life really thus far, but I think that one of my greatest strengths is analysing problems and wanting to fix those problems wanting to improve situations for people where you see things aren't working so well. And I really think given the right this job, for instance,

Brad:

mm-hmm yep.

Rikki:

I, I can apply that and actually make changes.

Brad:

Can I make an observation? I think one of your superpowers is you've got empathy.

Rikki:

Mm

Brad:

I really do.

Rikki:

Yeah.

Brad:

that you are a person who can walk in someone else's shoes

Rikki:

for sure.

Brad:

And that's really, really super important in what we do

Rikki:

it is

Brad:

one of the things that engineers struggle with is the end result. Isn't just about something working well, it's about changing those people's lives on the ground.

Rikki:

Yeah.

Brad:

Which is our purpose and I think having empathy in that space is a good place start

Rikki:

for sure. Thanks, Brad.

Erika:

And in what other ways, Brad, can Rikki use her superpowers at work?

Brad:

I think creating a solid team around you. I think that the, the things that you'll be able to do that others can't do is pull together a team of people. And even if you are not project lead, even if you're not the person who's running those things or whatever like that, I think just having you in that pod makes people gravitate towards that centre.

Rikki:

Mm. Hmm

Brad:

It makes people understand that there are other things aside from their needs.

Rikki:

Sure.

Brad:

So I think that's, that's also when you're in a group of people, cause I've seen it happen in the last few days. You pull people into that orbit and then people start talking about stuff they might not have spoken about before, which is really cool.

Erika:

And why is that talk about things they might not

Brad:

Because not everybody thinks on a wider plane, and it's good to have somebody in the group who does, who thinks beyond the narrow scope or whatever they're doing because we are human, and we, we are self interested so to have somebody that goes into that situation saying, well, it isn't all about me, it's about what we're doing or the client or the purpose of what we're doing

Rikki:

follow on.

Brad:

Absolutely

Rikki:

ramifications. Yeah.

Erika:

What do you think of Alice Springs and the red centre?

Rikki:

It is red. No, it is amazing. I did go out to a couple of

Brad:

dusty

Rikki:

it is dusty.

Erika:

That's just a Black Books reference?

Rikki:

It's beautiful,

Brad:

a Black Books reference sorry

Rikki:

I mean, it's beautiful.

Brad:

it's beautiful.

Rikki:

It's almost alien. Like when I first got here, just the Hills, just the colors, the materials trees and grasses. And it's just, I almost felt a little bit like I was on Mars, if that makes any sense. But its just got such a different, speed to Like it's very, very relaxing

Brad:

I think one of the things it's got those big skies, like it's just the big sky,

Rikki:

the sunshine,

Brad:

just I think that the sense of you're only this big in the scheme of things Is very much is the case, you five minutes outta town and already you're amongst the red Hills and all the rest of it. And you really are only this big in the scheme of things bit of perspective.

Rikki:

Yeah. Yeah. And the sunshine it's just. Adelaide winter, it's been about 12 degrees for the last couple of months and, and gray and rainy, and I, that part has been lovely.

Erika:

And you grew up in a small town, you grew up in Mount Gambier.

Rikki:

Yeah.

Erika:

Kind of

Rikki:

among, among a few. Yeah. Moved around a bit.

Erika:

Do you find Alice a different small town from Mount Gambier?

Rikki:

Really different? Yeah. Mount Gambier was much more contained. Alice it's it's quite spread out, from what I've seen.

Brad:

um Mount Gambier too I'd say is a bit more monoculture.

Rikki:

It is very monoculture. Yeah.

Brad:

been of times.

Rikki:

People tend to stick around Mount Gambier and if you're born there, you live there. That's for a lot of people. That's true. Whereas Alice has got such a, a broad, what transient, population, right? and a tonne of migration,

Brad:

maybe not the last few years, but certainly we have a very strong migrant population

Rikki:

which makes it such an exciting culture to be in

Brad:

and lots of different food.

Rikki:

Mm. Do like food.

Brad:

Yeah. So let's wrap it up

Erika:

Yeah, one last little closing question. Should we make Rikki do the interview question again?

Brad:

What was the interview question?

Erika:

So the interview question that I like to ask people is yourself, introduce yourself.

Brad:

Oh, not that question.

Erika:

in one or two sentence. Not that question?

Rikki:

I hated that question

Brad:

Oh, question. can't even answer it.

Rikki:

I know

Erika:

hard question,

Rikki:

because when you what are the rules?

Brad:

Why don't we just leave people who are listening to this podcast? Hanging on a thread. So the next time you see Erika Hamilton,

Rikki:

round town

Brad:

Whether around town in Alice Springs or Adelaide doing her thing, ask her what that question was and then see and see what the answer is and I will, for the best answer, I will give you a$50 gift voucher.

Rikki:

Yes

Brad:

The best answer that we come up with. So if you're listening to this, we'll see how many people actually listening to it. Send me, send us your answers to H6 and we'll see what comes out of it.. So I think we should wrap it up for there. It's been amazing talking to you, Rikki. Thank you for coming up to the Alice.

Rikki:

Thank you

Brad:

we'll be down in Adelaide fairly shortly for podcast 565, whatever it is. Podcast 11, I think it is isn't it?

Erika:

It will be 12.

Rikki:

12.

Brad:

There we go for podcast 12. I love doing these invisible skyscraper podcasts.

Rikki:

Mm-hmm

Brad:

I didn't think I would, but we've had some really good conversations. Erika and Kirsty had a really good couple of conversations and I think they'll lead on to bigger and better things. so.

Rikki:

yeah.

Brad:

Make sure you listen, see you all next time.

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Brad Bellette

Host
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Erika Hamilton

Co-host